The drive gear and idler gear with the bearing are not sold separately. TAP-2000 is a floor mounted shifter with Tap up Tap Down for GM 6/8L80/90E transmissions. Jeff Smith has had a passion for cars since he began working at his grandfather's gas station at the age 10. The stator shaft support housing is fitted with a converter drive gear and idler gear. 10L80 vs 10L90 - CAMARO6 2024 Mustang Prices Are Out, Dark Horse Is . LS Swap Automatic Transmission Guide - Chevy Hardcore And now, with some of these transmissions coming out of warranty, the aftermarket will soon begin to see issues that occur with them beyond their first years of life during their aging process. I would be willing to get it rebuilt, but want it to function like it should (not back to the way it came from GM). Related Articles ATI introduces new e-clutch hub for ZF8HP51 Sonnax adds new stator support bushing for Ford 6F35 Alto adds to intermediate clutch PowerPack line for GM transmissions According to Sonnax, the heavy OE LFS, GFX announced a new pump component for GM Powerglide models, covering several vintage model years: 1950 through 1973. The case is a cast aluminum alloy. 10 Speed 10L80 Transmission Build! ATFSpeed - YouTube This wavy nature of the clutch surface is made worse with many miles of usage. should check for clearance. It has factory size tires 275/55/20. Click Here to Email our Sales & Tech Staff 888-748-4655 Local: 330-965-7146 International: 001-330-652-5855 Mon-Fri 8am-5pm EST Sat-Sun: Closed or gross weight of 14,000 lbs. Reverse 4.87. A rebuilt 10L80 will only have a certain number of components that get replaced. Cost and Process, Torque Converter Problems: Symptoms & Replacement Cost, Transmission Solenoid: Symptoms & Replacement Cost, 10 Pro Tips on Buying Used Transmissions For Sale, P0700: Transmission Control System Malfunction (TCM), Pontiac Firebird Transmission Problems & Cost | 4L60E / 4L65, Cadillac SRX Transmission Problems & Cost | 5L40E | 6L50 | 6T70, Ford Crown Victoria Transmission Problems & Cost | 4R75E / 4R75W / 4R70W, Chevy Equinox Transmission Problems & Cost | 6T70 / 6T45 / AW55-50SN, Saturn Aura Transmission Problems & Cost | 6T70 | 6T40 | 4T45E. The 10R80 transmission is a 10-speed, rear-wheel-drive transmission that is controlled by a PCM or a TCM. It probably wont do much for the elapsed time which is all that really matters. The ideal upgrade for modified performance vehicles, Sonnax 3-bolt adapter flange yoke kit T35-GMFD-01K makes it easy to convert a two-piece driveline to a one-piece, U-joint-style driveline. Im with you on AFM is crap. Homepage: Garage: Wiki: Register: Community: Calendar: Today's Posts: Search: #Camaro6 . One common 6l80 issue due to design flaws include premature clutch failure. Much akin to the GM 10L80-E & 10L90-E transmissions is the 10R80 transmission's oil pump. 10L80 Transmission. Now, the high-speed CAN network allows a high rate of data sharing between the units to achieve a collaboration between both engine and transmission functions. All Rights Reserved. I have a 2012 Corvette Grand Sport Auto trans. A sectioned image of the 4L60-E TMBX and 6L80, 6L90 JMBX (Figure 3) shows the external profiles of the respective front covers are very similar. It would be a huge mistake not toAFM is garbage. (incl. If the power circuit to the transmission solenoids fails open, then all solenoids are failed electrically off. Would love your thoughts, please comment. Im not tuned ( not yet anyway), however, if I knew then what I know today, I probably would have went for the M6. Developing any new technology will cost an absolute ton of money, which why its not unusual for car companies to co-develop things like chassis and transmissions. 6L80/90E Swap FAQS | Chevy Trailblazer SS Forum It all comes down to the extra rigidity and flatness of the surfaces. It was created to help GM meet ever more demanding CAFE regulations on their vehicles. For now, the bulk of reported cases are related to diesel vehicles. The 6L80 is a robust transmission and can handle a ton of power. High Performance Transmission Rebuilds & Upgrades | Circle D The torque converter is a fluid turbine drive and - like those on its predecessor transmissions, the TH350C, 700R4, 4L60, and 4L80E - features a lock-up pressure plate for direct mechanically coupled driving from the engine crank. The TCI six-speed version has a few special additions to it. It is a heavy duty version of the 6L80 six speed automatic with a strengthened input gearset which has two additional pinion gears for six total and a strengthened output gearset that uses wider gears than the 6L80. To handle the increased output torque capacity, the 6L90 departed from the long-standing GM 32 spline specification output shaft of the 6L80 and went to larger diameter 29 spline for most truck applications. All this is handled with application of planetary ratios. Drivability concerns are confirmed, and the pan is chock full of debris. Thats right, you can find a variation of this Ford GM 10-speed automatic transmission in the Ford Mustang GT and the Chevrolet Camaro ZL1! I am currently planning on a high compression LS2 and a progressive nitrous kit but before another 4L80E goes in there is a 6,8, or 10 speed not an option? This creates an uneven force on the clutches that tends to . Heres what we mean: Lets assume we have a TH-400 trans in our Chevelle with a 4.10:1 rear gear. GM Transmission Dimensions - Pace Performance 2020 10l80 4wd an I one to convert to 2wd. It employs an even deeper First gear ratio of 4.02:1 with tighter gear splits but does not apply an overdrive for subsequent gears. 10R80 transmission swap? | SVTPerformance.com * DOES NOT INCLUDE A DRIVESHAFT OR CROSSMEMBER. After an internal inspection of your transmission, we will notify you of any hard part damage that will carry an additional cost. 10L80 Transmission Rebuild Parts | Raybestos Powertrain Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited. The 6L80 / 6L90 uses three-way solenoids and variable bleed solenoids for improved shift quality. The 10L80 transmission is a 10-speed longitudinal automatic transmission that was designed to operate near the efficiency of a CVT while improving fuel economy in GM high-horsepower vehicles highlighted by the Camaro, Suburban, Tahoe, and Escalade. $ 158.00 Select options. Im thinking 3.73. Your email address will not be published. Since 2003, Jeff has held various positions at Car Craft (including editor), has written books on small block Chevy performance, and even cultivated an impressive collection of 1965 and 1966 Chevelles. A 2005 Ford F350 with the 6.0 liter diesel engine and 5R110W transmission has set a P0753 Pressure Control Solenoid A - Electrical Fault code and a P2700 Transmission Friction Element A - Apply Time Out Of Range code. But the replacement of this assembly requires new bolts. US Shift Stand-Alone Transmission Controllers Running 12.60s at 111 is a fun ride! Structurally, the 8L90 is similar to the 8L45, except that it is made to handle more power and torque. 60 mph with cruise on going down hill and truck will start down shifting. It began replacing the 4L60E transmission in many vehicles starting in the 2006 model year. Each clutch is controlled by a corresponding shift solenoid A-F. Will this hurt the trani? Fluid Type Mercon ULV ATF 6L80, 6L90 Transmission Tech Advisory: Consider an Updated Converter in Your Next Rebuild We all know that automatic transmission failures can have many root causes. In fact, there are absolutely no cast-iron components, including the 10L80 stator support. TSB 18-NA-026 Transmission fluid leak Engine speed: Directly affects shift scheduling, Torque Converter Clutch (TCC) control, line pressure, and transmission diagnostics. All I can find is that it is sealed from the rear and just needs a new tail housing but some say its got to be completely rebuilt from the inside. However some 2wd vans and HD truck versions had a, J Series Trucks & Wagons, (I6 What came first: the chicken or the egg? Its a longitudinal transmission (thats what the L in 6L80E stands for). In doing this, we evaluated another GM unit the 4L60-E TMBX to see if we could pick up any clues. Production Began 2017 The 6L80 was approved for use in these vehicles weighing up to 8600 lbs. This drives up the price of the rebuilt converter, but ensures that this kind of failure wont happen again. Thanks Jeff. Wait 2 seconds. 10L80 Performance Transmission Rebuilds | Circle D Transmission Brian at Tommy Boys Performance, however, has the opportunity to work with a local dealership assisting them when their workload gets heavy. It's meant to be used with rear-wheel drive and it requires 8.4 quarts of fluid. You know where this is going yup, its the converter. Diagnosis and correction of a max line pressure condition may become, With Hondas 10-speed front wheel drive transmission (see Figure 1, above) going into its fifth year on the roads, its feasible that one may show up in your shop for service. Bowler Transmission Cooler Manifold for GM 6, 8, & 10 speed automatic The 6L80 Hydra-Matic transmission is a 6 speed automatic transmission manufactured by General Motors. We had to use a spacer from Advanced Adapters but otherwise they are the same. Chevrolet, Buick & GM Engines into the Jeep Ford 1.8L - 2.5L "Pinto" Engines into the Jeep 4L60E (and its tougher 4L65 & 4L70 variants). PDF PIP5477C 10L90 10L80 10 Speed Automatic Transmission Exchange Program Hi Jeff, I have a 2016 Silverado with the 5.3 and the 8 speed transmission. Tested: 2023 BMW M4 CSL Is a Track Monster. The thicker JMBX piston cant conform to the cover (like it can in the 4L60-E TMBX), and at a commanded slip rate of approximately 50 RPMs in lockup, there is ultimately metal-to-metal contact that occurs between the front cover and the piston. Maximum engine input torque for the 6L80 is 440 ft. lbs. I didnt realize that it came equiped with such a lame gear ration 3.08. If you have any questions that I may be able to help you with, drop a comment or contact me. The transmission will bolt up but will not work since the TCM, Tehcm and BCM are application specific and cannot interchanged. It is an incredibly advanced transmission and has the technology to . How do Sonnax components prevent the failure that plagues these units? 4L60E (bellhousing pattern - Chevrolet/removable), 4L60E / 4L65E (w/ removable bellhousing) All LS1 Type, 4L80E 1991-Later (bellhousing pattern - Chevrolet), 6L80E 2006-Later (w/ removable bellhousing), 6L90E 2006-Later (w/ removable bellhousing), Splines (output shaft)Pan Bolts (number of), Transmission Fluid Capacity (see also capacity of fluid in the converter here). Both covers have very similar profiles and thicknesses, and you would not expect that one would be any more prone to flex or distortion than the other. 10L80 Performance Rebuild. The new Third gear in the TCI trans is 1.57:1, which is then overdriven to create Fourth gear which is 1.57 x 0.75 = 1.18:1 which is just 18 percent away from direct drive 1:1, which becomes Fifth gear. Knowledge is power use it to protect your customer, your unit and yourself for miles and miles to come. Note: The mounting pad is usually a part of the extension housing, but the graphic shows it on the maine case. Since these are straight cut gears, they will tend to be somewhat noisy. The overall First gear ratio is 2.48 x 4.10 = 10.17:1. I'd be modding it to a FBO car with cam and converter eventually. The CIDAS (Casting Integrated Direct Acting Solenoid) are all normally low solenoids. Established Member. The 6L80 / 6L90 TEHCM is located inside of the transmission on the 6L80 / 6L90 valve body. Seems like the 6 speed auto would be better for the torque curve. It can also be found in the Lincoln Navigator. So, what's the unique problem with the 6L80, 6L90 converter found in full-size vehicles? It's RPO code is "MYC" and it is domestically manufactured in GM's Ypsilanti, Michigan plant. if the car would be faster with the 6 speed auto vs the 10 speed auto. document.write("- "+yr);
While converter failures are not uncommon with other transmission families, you are thinking that this is really becoming a pattern for the 6L80, 6L90. One needs to realize that the stamped covers are not all that flat to begin with. GM has been useless to say the least, and waited me out (now off warranty). The bottom line: The very thin (.020") woven carbon friction material cant survive the way the JMBX piston applies. The 6L80 denotes that the transmission is a 6-Speed, Longitudinally mounted, and for 8000 lbs. Then to create a new Second gear, the overdrive is engaged 2.97 x 0.75 = 2.23:1. But its interesting to note that there is a very low cover/piston failure rate for the 4L60-E TMBX converter. 8 Options if Your Transmission Has Failed, Transmission Diagnostic Trouble Codes (DTC), Best Remanufactured Transmission Companies, Hybrid Battery Replacement Cost and Prices, 10 Most Common Transmission Problems & How to Fix Them, How to Change Transmission Fluid Step by Step, What is a Transmission Flush? Remember, this is just a theory. only) '72-'79, Small Block V8, Gen. The solenoids are calibrated from the factory and are not all the same. TH350 High Performance Transmissions / 850 Hp Full Race, TH400 High Performance Transmissions / Stage II - Stage VI, TH200-4R High Performance Transmissions / Stage I - Stage III och Full Race, TH700R4 / 4L60E / 4l65E High Performance Transmissions / Stage II - Stage V, 4L80E / 4L85E High Performance Transmissions / Stage I - Stage V, 6L80E / 6L90E High Performance Transmissions / Standard - 1000Hp, Speed Potential Calculator for Ring Gear and Pinion Changes, Engine Alternatives. all that is needed is a Throttle position signal and Engine RPM. Gears Magazine
At this point, the converter rebuilder is faced with either finding another core that he hopes will have good components or purchasing a Sonnax forged cover GM-CC-13 and forged piston GM-DA-17P. Beginning with the F-150, it then made its way into the Mustang and the Expedition (as well as the Everest, and upcoming Ranger reboot). It is a heavy-duty version of the 6L80 six-speed automatic, with a strengthened input gearset which has two additional pinion gears for six total, and a strengthened output gearset, that uses wider gears than the 6L80. GM 6L45E 6L50E 6L80E 6L90E TCM2650 transmission controller harness Is the out put shaft and splines on a 4L80E the same as a turbo 400? * WILL ALLOW USE . Always inspect the sump for possible evidence of debris that could indicate the pump drive gears could be failing. Electronic challenges exist when mixing and matching the 6L80 as they must be matched to their particular engine. And you are correct the converters in these units are experiencing a high percentage of failure and are more problematic than normal. The transmission typically accepts a 6.3 quart fill. Most of the larger displacement applications will have an auxiliary oil-to-air cooler in the system as well. I believe AFM has been replaced with DFM Not for fact nojust was basing on the truck. It is a 5 position shifter, Park, Reverse, Neutral, Drive and Sport Mode. Team ATF builder Super Dave doing his magic on assembling the First 10L80 transmission ATFSpeed has had come thru the shop. The readers on this site are a pretty sharp bunch. The small 10-speed gear steps allow the engine speed to drop to lower values than it would in the 6-speed transmission, providing for the best fuel economy. Wait 3-5 minutes before driving. 10R80 transmission swap? See the pictures below to help you tell if you have the right transmission. Its been on the road for a few years, and were starting to see some common failures for this unit. 10L80 vs 10L90 Transmissions. Thx The customer approves a teardown. TRU-STREET 10L90E TRANSMISSION W/ 1800 STALL LOCK UP CONVERTER. In this video I show how to change flush the transmission fluid and filter on a 2012 Chevrolet Silverado with 6.2L with the 6 speed automatic 6L80E Conceptually, locking the converter should help the mph trap speed by reducing slippage. General Motors 6L80-E & 6L90-E Transmission Problems & Solutions If the warmer is not mounted to the transmission, refer to factory information to locate it. Copyright 2023 - Transmission Repair Cost Guide. In any event, precise coordinate measuring (CMM scans) of a variety of JMBX covers shows that the covers are wavy and have undulations on the clutch surface, especially opposite of the welded cover pads. if (yr!=2012)
GM 10L80 Transmission: Specs & Updates - Transmission Repair Cost Guide The location of the warmer and the routing of the hoses can vary widely. The TCM-2650 is compatible with the GM 6L45/50, 6L80/90 . General 10-speed automatic with integral turbine clutch torque converter Its a single-disc, non-captive clutch unit that is somewhat similar to late 300mm 4L60-E converters. The new 2019 Camaro gets the a10 but, Its not the a10 (10L90) from the ZL1. Its the a10 (10L80) from the Silverado. Complaints of erratic shifting, poor shift quality, missed shifts, and other shifting and TCC control complaints are becoming more common with these units. Quick 6 Clutch-to-Clutch Transmission Control System Our top-of-the-line controller for 6R80 transmissions. That year, for the first time, the 10R80 ten-speed transmission was available with the 2.7-liter EcoBoost V6, 3.5-liter EcoBoost V6, or 5.0-liter Coyote V8 engine options and was even an option with their popular Raptor model. But tall highway gearing arent the only way that this transmission maximizes efficiency. At times the 10-speed transmission may skip gears when the vehicle starts from a complete stop. These concerns may be caused by a sticking TCC Regulator Valve (Figure 5). GM LS1 - LS9 / Chrysler Gen III and Viper V10, Conversion. RATIOS 4.70, 2.99, 2.15, 1.80, 1.52, 1.28, 1.00, .85, .69, .64. Why the thin woven carbon clutch doesnt typically fail in the 4L60-E TMBX. Although the basic engineering is the same, the GM 10L80 and Ford 10R80 each have proprietary control software, along with a few other differences that are suited for each specific application. The 6L80 would have big shoes to fill, with legendary predecessors like the TH400, 4L80E and 4L60E transmissions. Now he serves as a regular contributor to OnAllCylinders. When other diagnostic trouble codes are present, there can be different, specific drivability concerns caused by the failure management program. We all know that automatic transmission failures can have many root causes. 3. Required fields are marked *. - Critical wear areas and vacuum test locations: GM 10L and Ford 10R series. A more recent issue with these units is pump drive gear failure (Figure 7). The 6L80 features a generously deep first gear for an automatic, making for favorably powerful starts from a standing stop. Trans temps climbed to 195 and has stayed there ever since. Brake very gently to a complete stop and hold the foot brake for five (5) seconds. But once he had the parts and the job was complete, the noise issue was resolved, confirming the cause to be the idler gear spinning around the ball bearings outer race. While the 6L80 is generally mechanically compatible with Chevrolet and GM Gen. III+ engines, due to its advanced control strategy, the 6L80 is functionally compatible only with Generation IV GM engines and their matched Engine Control Modules. Internal hydraulic leakage, hard part failures and contaminated/failed solenoids are all issues that can plague units, some more than others. Also fits '05-'06 Pontiac GTO (differential side). Codes P0741 or P1744 may or may not set in the PCM or TCM (depending on application). The Sonnax forged covers and pistons are designed to be flat and will stay that way through the forces of converter welding, miles of driving and varying input torque from the engine. The original first three gear ratios are in fact still the same as the TH-400. Beginning in 2010, all 2500 and 3500 Express / Savana with a 4.8L or 6.0L engine used the 6L90 transmission.